Lack of Depth is our undoing against SH

Talk XU Men's basketball here...
XU80
Posts: 188
Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2008 4:16 pm
Contact:

Lack of Depth is our undoing against SH

Postby XU80 » Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:25 am

With 10 minutes to go, we are up 58-48 and then we implode making many bad decisions causing unforced turnovers. SH played a rotation of 9 and we had Goodin logging 40 minutes, Scruggs 39 minutes and Marshall 36 minutes. Travis has to figure out a way to get a few breaks for those three or the likelihood of injury goes up to an already depleted roster.

I thought the first half was the best half we played all year, getting great looks, sharing the ball and not settling for the three, the last ten minutes were a mess, with one on one play, bad shot selection and not sharing the basketball. I think mental and physical fatigue had a role. The players don't just go bad after that a good first 30 minutes.
X-Expert
Posts: 2011
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 10:12 pm
Contact:

Re: Lack of Depth is our undoing against SH

Postby X-Expert » Thu Jan 03, 2019 8:48 am

I think there is some truth to the lack of depth hurting X (thanks Chris Mack) but also just poor decision making. Goodin played well in the first half as he realized he is the 5th best offensive option on the floor. He created for others and played decent D on Powell. In the second half, his shot selection and overall decision making was bad. Overall, he had 6 assists and 6 turnovers; shot 3-10 from the field and 1-3 from 3. the player he was guarding scored 25 points. X's biggest problem is that in a close game, X will (and should) rely heavily on goodin. Its up to goodin and steele to get the best players in position to score. All teams will be thrilled to have Goodin or Marshall take that important shot. goodin shoots 37.7% and 27.3% from 3 and 69% from the line. In the two BE games, its even worse (5-20 FG and 2-10 from 3s). His assist//TO ratio however is good at just over 2x. marshall shoots 41% from the field and 22% from 3 and 71% from the line. My only comfort in yesterdays game was that Scruggs took more shots then goodin/Marshall. Both Scruggs and Welage shoot over 44% from 3 and Scruggs shoots 52% from the field and 77% at the line. Welage shoots 45% from 3 and 47% from the field and 84% at the line. Need to get the ball in the hands of these players more. As for depth, need to play Kennedy more. I just assume Steele has no confidence in Hardin. I realize kennedy doesn't do much but frankly, they need to develop another player. goodin was not good his freshman year until Sumner got hurt and was forced to play. given how poorly goodin/marshall play in spurts, Kennedy can spell them a little more.
bluegrass
Posts: 3197
Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2008 1:32 pm
Contact:

Re: Lack of Depth is our undoing against SH

Postby bluegrass » Thu Jan 03, 2019 12:34 pm

Lack of a bench is probably the biggest weakness of this team. We only have 10 scholarship players so we are at least two short of where we should be. And there's not much depth at the guard position. If Gooden's not out there than Scruggs is the only realistic backup for him at point. I think Hardin is a a lost cause. If he can't get in this year I don't see him coming back next year. Caslin is just a body.He doesnt offer anything. I thought coming into this year Q,Naji ,Ty and Scruggs would have to carry a heavy load. They have been inconsistent. Haskins has played well and Welage is the only reliable 3 point shooter we have . Bottom line it's just going to be a struggle this year. Hopefully our returning players get better and next year's freshmen class can contribute.there's bound to be some senior transfers that can step in and help us next year too. I'd be surprised if we can even be a 500 team this year. I think that actually would be a pretty good accomplishment
User avatar
muskieman
Posts: 22345
Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2008 10:34 pm
Contact:

Re: Lack of Depth is our undoing against SH

Postby muskieman » Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:01 pm

as I mentioned on the game thread. I have a question of why Kennedy deserves time because, while he is a bigger body, he has not showed us his D that people talk about and in the games since Illinois has done almost nothing, well he did get 4 fouls in 6 minutes against DePaul if you are looking for a stat stuffer. The Hardin situation is pretty much the same good game against Illinois and then drops off the production sheet, I expect him to get his head straight but maybe he needs someone to sit him down and give him a good talking to... "Dad". 1 minute against DePaul and not even a sniff of the court against SH...could he be under the weather or maybe it is something else! He is not endearing himself to the coach.

Castlin looks like a scared player out there which I think is effecting his game. He doesn't want to make a mistake and then makes one when others don't give him the ball where he can make shots.

James looks like a tourist looking at all the pretty lights and well can't seem to know where he should be while a play is running.

One thing for sure our starters need a blow but the 4 guys Castlin, Hardin, Kennedy and James have added nothing of value yet and need to get their acts together. Playing a 7 man rotation is bound to show up at the end of a game.
I asked a ref if he could give me a technical foul for thinking bad things about him. He said, of course not. I said, well, I think you stink. And he gave me a technical. You can't trust em.
joeabe
Posts: 142
Joined: Thu Nov 27, 2008 12:27 am
Contact:

Re: Lack of Depth is our undoing against SH

Postby joeabe » Thu Jan 03, 2019 3:31 pm

Basketball is definitely in the era of " 3 point is king ". We are in trouble. Don't know if you can make up the lack of scoring from the 3 at even a minimal rate to win?. We are atrocious and this is not a knock on our players. Its simply a fact. Really don't believe a player can improve 3 point shooting by much through coaching and practice, you can either naturally shoot well or not . These sharp shooters need to be recruited. Looking at our roster I feel we are 2-3 years away from having a full deck. Unless of course next years crop of frosh are superstars. If this team can get some bench help and continue on our play of the first half of last nites game we could have a respectable season. Pray they can maintain their spirit as L's have a way of wearing on a team/coach mentally as well as physically. I really feel for coach Steele. He inherited a most difficult situation to say the least. New coach, new staff, depleted roster, fan base used to winning at a high level. I hope with his intellegence, recruiting ability and belief in his skills he brings us to greatness. However, for the situation he inherited it would have made more sense gor our AD to bring in an existing/proven winner HC. Either a guy who has had great success and then fallen on hard times and on the rebound or an up and comer from a smaller conference and winning! Tennessee did it, Auburn did it, Arizona St did it, Butler did it with the guy that's at OSU now. Hell we did it with Matta. We put Steele in a very difficult situation....agreed? Bear Bryant's best quote "Its hard to have a circus without the animals". Steele's roster is depleted of scorers! I don't care how hard and smart he coaches the results will be the same.
kyzrex
Posts: 1542
Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2008 8:35 am
Contact:

Re: Lack of Depth is our undoing against SH

Postby kyzrex » Thu Jan 03, 2019 9:11 pm

Have to agree with most of this thread. Not using all of the open scholarships, having players leave early before their eligibility is up, and not getting better recruits last year has left this team woefully short of quality death. Steele can not be blamed for this. The question becomes, is there anything X can do to overcome this and salvage something out of this season? IMO, no there isn’t, IF all you are going to look at is the record. I’ll still watch every game and root for them to win, but in reality I don’t see X being favored an any game the rest of the season other than the 2nd DePaul game. Not saying they won’t win some, I think they will. But I don’t see any easy victories out there. Every game will probably be a struggle. However, if Steel wants to concentrate on building a program, and not just winning games this year, then there is a lot that can be done. Establishing the way he wants his players to play in terms of effort and intelligence is something that he needs to concentrate on. Developing depth for NEXT year, and even the year after, means that the freshmen must get playing time. Even if it means hurting their chances for victories this year. Determination of the future Hardin has with the club needs to be made over the next month or so. If it is determined that he can help the club next year, then he needs playing time this year. They need to work on making sure that the players that are playing, and that will be returning next year, are not allowed to develop bad habits.

The next 3 months should be all about development for NEXT year and for the years to come.
#WHYNOTX?
X-lucidity
Posts: 859
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2011 1:06 pm
Contact:

Re: Lack of Depth is our undoing against SH

Postby X-lucidity » Thu Jan 03, 2019 9:30 pm

very well stated Kyzrex. Set a consistent tone of expectations & effort as well as develop the youth AMAP.
bluegrass
Posts: 3197
Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2008 1:32 pm
Contact:

Re: Lack of Depth is our undoing against SH

Postby bluegrass » Fri Jan 04, 2019 8:58 am

joeabe wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 3:31 pm
Basketball is definitely in the era of " 3 point is king ". We are in trouble. Don't know if you can make up the lack of scoring from the 3 at even a minimal rate to win?. We are atrocious and this is not a knock on our players. Its simply a fact. Really don't believe a player can improve 3 point shooting by much through coaching and practice, you can either naturally shoot well or not . These sharp shooters need to be recruited. Looking at our roster I feel we are 2-3 years away from having a full deck. Unless of course next years crop of frosh are superstars. If this team can get some bench help and continue on our play of the first half of last nites game we could have a respectable season. Pray they can maintain their spirit as L's have a way of wearing on a team/coach mentally as well as physically. I really feel for coach Steele. He inherited a most difficult situation to say the least. New coach, new staff, depleted roster, fan base used to winning at a high level. I hope with his intellegence, recruiting ability and belief in his skills he brings us to greatness. However, for the situation he inherited it would have made more sense gor our AD to bring in an existing/proven winner HC. Either a guy who has had great success and then fallen on hard times and on the rebound or an up and comer from a smaller conference and winning! Tennessee did it, Auburn did it, Arizona St did it, Butler did it with the guy that's at OSU now. Hell we did it with Matta. We put Steele in a very difficult situation....agreed? Bear Bryant's best quote "Its hard to have a circus without the animals". Steele's roster is depleted of scorers! I don't care how hard and smart he coaches the results will be the same.
Good shooting will make up for a world of ills.Unfortunately outside of Welage and maybe Scruggs,we don't have a lot of outside shooters.Also Ty and Zack aren't able to score unless it's right around the basket.I wish one of them could step out to the fouls line and sink a shot.
This a tough situation for a rookie coach.A lot of our past coaches walked into good situations their first year.Throw in the fact that the BE is a lot tougher league than the A10 or MCC. I think Steele's ability to handle the mental part of coaching will be more important than the x's and o's. He has to keep these guys believing in themselves thru the losses and I think there will be a lot of those. One more reason for the fan base to stay behind them too.
X-Expert
Posts: 2011
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 10:12 pm
Contact:

Re: Lack of Depth is our undoing against SH

Postby X-Expert » Fri Jan 04, 2019 9:46 am

muskieman wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:01 pm
as I mentioned on the game thread. I have a question of why Kennedy deserves time because, while he is a bigger body, he has not showed us his D that people talk about and in the games since Illinois has done almost nothing, well he did get 4 fouls in 6 minutes against DePaul if you are looking for a stat stuffer. The Hardin situation is pretty much the same good game against Illinois and then drops off the production sheet, I expect him to get his head straight but maybe he needs someone to sit him down and give him a good talking to... "Dad". 1 minute against DePaul and not even a sniff of the court against SH...could he be under the weather or maybe it is something else! He is not endearing himself to the coach.

Castlin looks like a scared player out there which I think is effecting his game. He doesn't want to make a mistake and then makes one when others don't give him the ball where he can make shots.

James looks like a tourist looking at all the pretty lights and well can't seem to know where he should be while a play is running.

One thing for sure our starters need a blow but the 4 guys Castlin, Hardin, Kennedy and James have added nothing of value yet and need to get their acts together. Playing a 7 man rotation is bound to show up at the end of a game.
MM have never seen you take such a hard line against X players. Getting frustrated like the rest of us. As for Kennedy, Steele clearly thinks he deserves time given the fact that other than Welage and Jones, he gets the most minutes of the reserves and usually gets in every game. bottom line here is that while he may not seem productive, they need another player. In the past, X was able to slide OMara in as a freshman and sophomore because X was so good and deep. We as fans didn't notice as much how bad he was then. goodin played a little as a freshman before Sumners injury and was awful but when forced to play, improved with each game. I believe X has to develop at least one more player here. Both Mack and Steele felt he was worth recruiting and retaining after he decommited so they see something in him. As for Hardin, he rarely sees the floor. I'm guessing Steele just doesn't think he is productive or will be considering he talked him into staying when he took over.
lionelchalmers0
Posts: 274
Joined: Tue Apr 24, 2012 7:41 am
Contact:

Re: Lack of Depth is our undoing against SH

Postby lionelchalmers0 » Fri Jan 04, 2019 11:07 pm

I think we really need to temper our expectations at this point. Not for the long term, because I fully expect us to be a top 20 program year in and year out. But this is a horribly constructed roster with a very low overall basketball IQ. This team is not going to flip a switch and suddenly stop turning the ball over and become amazing 3 point shooters.

I like Steele, and I don't put nearly as much of this on him as others. I think the judgment on him this year will boil down to how much heart the team shows in the last ten games or so as their tourney hopes are disappearing. Can we get the maximum out of guys? Will Naji and Q stay engaged? Will castlin and welage dig a little deeper? If Steele can just get this team to stick together and improve a bit it would be a win. I'll reserve my judgment on him for 1-2 years from now and how he reconstructs the roster.

I don't think it's fair to judge a first year coach for godawful mistakes made constantly by upper classmen on this team. If these players don't have the IQ to stop jacking up 3s they can't hit or stop turning the ball over again and again, that's on them. As a high level D1 player you should be better than that regardless of the coach.

This roster would be difficult to coach. Q is shooting horribly? Naji is self destructing? Tyrique is getting murdered on the boards because he's now a skinny 6'7 center? Who is Steele supposed to bring in? Even if he wants to make a change to send a message there's no one else at the end of the bench to look to.

Return to “Xavier Men's Basketball”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: gundun, muskienick and 25 guests