Free v KyKy

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sweet67
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Free v KyKy

Postby sweet67 » Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:47 am

Anti-Homer made a great point in yesterday's game thread that I think is worth a discussion.

Few would argue that Zach and KyKy are very good offensive players that leave a lot to be desired defensively. They are young and still learning, which I get.

I think Kyky has a higher upside offensively than just about anyone on the roster.

So why is it that Free gets a pass and big minutes while KyKy gets the pine? Is it attitude or what? Kyky seems to bust his tail when on the court just like everyone else. I like Zach as a player and competitor, but at times, he has been abused defensively.

Interested to hear what others think.
finalfourorbust
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Re: Free v KyKy

Postby finalfourorbust » Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:53 am

Besides Zack being the leading scorer and rebounder on the team and them not having anybody else healthy that plays his position I can't think of a reason.
edgecliff hall
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Re: Free v KyKy

Postby edgecliff hall » Mon Jan 11, 2021 12:20 pm

Sweet 67, I sure do get a kick out of watching all these feisty young players going hard at it. (Insert names here) Each one of them, giving it all he's got. Can't know what will be their future, but I do know, as the old song goes, THEY GOT HEART.
longliveskip
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Re: Free v KyKy

Postby longliveskip » Mon Jan 11, 2021 12:46 pm

sweet67 wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:47 am
Anti-Homer made a great point in yesterday's game thread that I think is worth a discussion.

Few would argue that Zach and KyKy are very good offensive players that leave a lot to be desired defensively. They are young and still learning, which I get.

I think Kyky has a higher upside offensively than just about anyone on the roster.

So why is it that Free gets a pass and big minutes while KyKy gets the pine? Is it attitude or what? Kyky seems to bust his tail when on the court just like everyone else. I like Zach as a player and competitor, but at times, he has been abused defensively.

Interested to hear what others think.
Free on his 5th Gold Jersey of the year this week.

that tells me all i need to know about how hard he goes every day in practice, how much he competes day in and day out, etc.

yes, not having much depth in the frontcourt bodes well for Free as there aren't really any options to go to to take away his minutes, especially now that Stanley is done. our guard depth is huge which is what is leaving KyKy watching from the sidelines now.
WestCoastMuskie
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Re: Free v KyKy

Postby WestCoastMuskie » Mon Jan 11, 2021 1:10 pm

KyKy is a proven talent. And he deserves the time to develop. This coaching staff does not seem to develop players. Losing KyKy to transfer which is almost a certainty now, is a shame. We had potentially the next Kyrie Irving. Spacing on offense and the ability to score matter as much as defense in this game, and too often our coaches get way too invested in defense (which really isn't that good).
longliveskip
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Re: Free v KyKy

Postby longliveskip » Mon Jan 11, 2021 1:36 pm

WestCoastMuskie wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 1:10 pm
KyKy is a proven talent. And he deserves the time to develop. This coaching staff does not seem to develop players. Losing KyKy to transfer which is almost a certainty now, is a shame. We had potentially the next Kyrie Irving. Spacing on offense and the ability to score matter as much as defense in this game, and too often our coaches get way too invested in defense (which really isn't that good).
the next Kyrie Irving??? really???

"this staff does not seem to develop players" - well, this staff has been together for 3 seasons. let's give them a chance to have a class of players for 4 years and then make that determination.

KyKy CAN score but he simply hasn't shown the ability to do that within the system that Xavier runs. he needs to adapt/change/work harder/etc. if he isn't willing to do those things, then he can move on to somewhere else.

i don't want to lose him. i want him to figure it out and be a great player for X. not up to the coaching staff to just "give" him minutes because you think he "deserves the time to develop". Steele, as a coach, doesn't have that luxury. he needs to WIN to get into the NCAA tourney or he's not going to be around very long. he's not going to sacrifice wins just because one players needs to "develop".
sweet67
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Re: Free v KyKy

Postby sweet67 » Mon Jan 11, 2021 1:44 pm

finalfourorbust wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:53 am
Besides Zack being the leading scorer and rebounder on the team and them not having anybody else healthy that plays his position I can't think of a reason.
I would be curious to see what Kyky could produce in the minutes Free gets.

I assume Kyky has been told he needs to improve defensively to earn more minutes, which I agree with. But it has to be frustrating being such a talented player watching a teammate get big minutes while scoring 16 but giving up 20.

I'd be a little upset too.
longliveskip
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Re: Free v KyKy

Postby longliveskip » Mon Jan 11, 2021 2:04 pm

sweet67 wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 1:44 pm
finalfourorbust wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:53 am
Besides Zack being the leading scorer and rebounder on the team and them not having anybody else healthy that plays his position I can't think of a reason.
I would be curious to see what Kyky could produce in the minutes Free gets.

I assume Kyky has been told he needs to improve defensively to earn more minutes, which I agree with. But it has to be frustrating being such a talented player watching a teammate get big minutes while scoring 16 but giving up 20.

I'd be a little upset too.
a couple things flawed with this comparison - KyKy isn't getting his minutes taken away from Zach. Frontcourt is now thin with no Stanley so unless Travis elects to go "small", depending on the matchup, more guards aren't going to get more minutes. you should ask if, maybe, he got more of Scruggs or Kunkel or Johnson's minutes, would it be different.

if you want to compare Free vs KyKy, though, here's their +/- from the box scores that actually gave that stat:

Oak, KyKy +37 Free +45
Brad +1 -11
Tol -2 +12
EKU +1 +9
TT +25 +8
UC -7 +11
OK +7 +19
SJU -1 0
Prov - -1

do with that what you please.
X-Expert
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Re: Free v KyKy

Postby X-Expert » Mon Jan 11, 2021 3:21 pm

Who knows what goes on in practice so perhaps there are other reasons for his lack of PT. From what i see, KyKy doesn't make great decisions on the court and to compare to Free is tough because there are no other viable options at Freemantle's position. Stanley getting hurt keeps Free on the floor even more. X doesn't really have true bigs just a bunch of 4s and Freemantle has the body closest to a 5. KyKy is truly a 2 at the D-1 level and not a PG. He struggles handling the ball and unlike true PGs, he wants his shot first rather than look for others. Agree that he has a higher upside than many but X has an abundant of people that can do what he brings to the table-shooting and they likely play better D. I hope he stays as he would certainly have a bigger role next year with Johnson and Scruggs moving on. X would have Odom, Tandy, Wilcher, Jones, and Kunkel. Would be nice to have him back as a pure shooter along with Wilcher and Kunkel. That said, I could see him going to a team like UC. They started recruiting him with Mick and UC needs shooters. A conference like the AAC would be easier for him as well-like when Drew Lavender came to X from Oklahoma.
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muskieman
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Re: Free v KyKy

Postby muskieman » Mon Jan 11, 2021 4:32 pm

I'd like to see Kyky practice hard enough to get a gold jersey or two or three before I complain about him not getting playing time. I like him and hope he can be that sparkplug that comes in as a scoring machine but you have to bring something more
I asked a ref if he could give me a technical foul for thinking bad things about him. He said, of course not. I said, well, I think you stink. And he gave me a technical. You can't trust em.

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