"Rivals" ranks recruiting classes for 2021 and 2022, so far. and Xavier ranks....

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kyzrex
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Re: "Rivals" ranks recruiting classes for 2021 and 2022, so far. and Xavier ranks....

Postby kyzrex » Mon Apr 26, 2021 7:48 am

muskieman wrote:
Sun Apr 25, 2021 10:36 pm
kyzrex wrote:
Sun Apr 25, 2021 8:01 pm
Just exactly how does Xavier have “better” personal than last year? Seems to me that they have just about the SAME personal as last year. Is Nunge better than Carter? Possibly, but he was still just a backup at Iowa. Carter was an All-MAC player coming in and was expected to return to that level of play in his 2nd year at X. But he didn’t. How Nunge will do is only a guess. Will the freshman add anything? Possibly, but they are still almost total unknowns. They lost Whilcher and Johnson is coming off of major knee surgery. I don’t really see how they can be considered much better than they were last year at this point. I can understand why nobody has them ranked preseason. It’s no indictment of the coach, it’s an indictment of the roster.

It also doesn’t mean crap at this point. Preseason rankings are almost totally worthless. They mean nothing, prove nothing, and only serve for message boards fodder. In the old days we would say that they weren’t worth the paper they were written on.
Back up to the POY in college basketball. He may not be the difference maker but his length is so much better than Carter's and his 6'11" 245 lbs frame is a better body banging on the inside. Let's give him a chance
I hope he is a real difference maker, I sincerely HOPE he is. But at this point that’s all it is...HOPE. But it’s not just him being better than Carter. Whilcher certainly had some contributions that won’t be there anymore, and who knows if Johnson is the player he was in the early season? Can the freshman contribute and will we see improvement from the returning players or will they play at the same levels they did last year? Every offseason we go through this same dance where optimism that is based more on hope than on fact makes some people almost blind to the deficiencies of the team. Then, when the team doesn’t meet their lofty unrealistic expectations, they turn around and blame the coaches for the loses and the problems.

Xavier has been basically a .500 team in the BE since they have joined. They have been midpack except for 2 seasons. By the 3rd, 4th, or even 5th season of a players career they are basically what they are. Only in very rare instances does a player suddenly become a lot more productive in their senior year, than they were in the their prior years. Occasionally a freshman or a transfer comes in and makes a huge difference, but it’s not real common, it’s not something that’s expected from players rated in the 90-125 area. Nunge isn’t rated in the top 100 transfers and both freshman are barely in the top 100-125.

So I ask again....why exactly would someone think that Xavier has had a huge jump in their roster value since last year’s sub .500 in the BE team? Why do some people think that the Xavier program is an “elite” BE program that should be challenging for a top
25 ranking and a BE championship in 2021-22?
#WHYNOTX?
Xavier2005
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Re: "Rivals" ranks recruiting classes for 2021 and 2022, so far. and Xavier ranks....

Postby Xavier2005 » Mon Apr 26, 2021 9:37 am

I for one do not expect a great change for next year. We had a Xavier team which did poorly during a regular season and yet they won the Conference tournament , went to the Elite 8 and almost made the FF. The closest X has been. Whereas, X had a team seeded number ONE and lost in the second round of the NCAA tournament. You just cannot figure these kids out or figure out a team. The BE as a Conference is seldom ranked one of the best Conferences and only Villanova really out performs . Beyond Villanova being real good most years ...all the other BE teams are just so so.
longliveskip
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Re: "Rivals" ranks recruiting classes for 2021 and 2022, so far. and Xavier ranks....

Postby longliveskip » Mon Apr 26, 2021 11:21 am

Xavier2005 wrote:
Mon Apr 26, 2021 9:37 am
I for one do not expect a great change for next year. We had a Xavier team which did poorly during a regular season and yet they won the Conference tournament , went to the Elite 8 and almost made the FF. The closest X has been. Whereas, X had a team seeded number ONE and lost in the second round of the NCAA tournament. You just cannot figure these kids out or figure out a team. The BE as a Conference is seldom ranked one of the best Conferences and only Villanova really out performs . Beyond Villanova being real good most years ...all the other BE teams are just so so.
2005 - with all due respect, is the pollen count frying your brain cells before this post? are you comparing "THE RUN" in the A-10 to the team we had as a #1 seed? if you're saying you can't figure out these kids or a team then why are you already set on not expecting a great change for next year? seems kind of contradictory.

BE seldom ranked as one of the best conferences??? seriously? this is where i thought the pollen had really gotten to you. BE has been one of the best bball conferences, especially since Xavier joined. that's why the league schedule is such a grind. yes, like any other league we have some bottom feeders (DePaul and St. Johns (mostly with Mullin)) but the league itself is top 5 in the country every year.

take some Claritin and re-read your post, then let's discuss again. ;)

GO MUSKIES!
tacitus
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Re: "Rivals" ranks recruiting classes for 2021 and 2022, so far. and Xavier ranks....

Postby tacitus » Mon Apr 26, 2021 5:42 pm

longliveskip wrote:
Mon Apr 26, 2021 11:21 am
Xavier2005 wrote:
Mon Apr 26, 2021 9:37 am
I for one do not expect a great change for next year. We had a Xavier team which did poorly during a regular season and yet they won the Conference tournament , went to the Elite 8 and almost made the FF. The closest X has been. Whereas, X had a team seeded number ONE and lost in the second round of the NCAA tournament. You just cannot figure these kids out or figure out a team. The BE as a Conference is seldom ranked one of the best Conferences and only Villanova really out performs . Beyond Villanova being real good most years ...all the other BE teams are just so so.
2005 - with all due respect, is the pollen count frying your brain cells before this post? are you comparing "THE RUN" in the A-10 to the team we had as a #1 seed? if you're saying you can't figure out these kids or a team then why are you already set on not expecting a great change for next year? seems kind of contradictory.

BE seldom ranked as one of the best conferences??? seriously? this is where i thought the pollen had really gotten to you. BE has been one of the best bball conferences, especially since Xavier joined. that's why the league schedule is such a grind. yes, like any other league we have some bottom feeders (DePaul and St. Johns (mostly with Mullin)) but the league itself is top 5 in the country every year.

take some Claritin and re-read your post, then let's discuss again. ;)

GO MUSKIES!
Yes... wow... in both conference RPI and conference NET, the Big East has been one of the top three leagues I think every year since we joined, until this year. This year we finished 6th and 4th respectively. (Need we be reminded that there are 32 conferences??) I think we finished the season as the top league in one or both of those rankings twice during that same 8-year period. In addition, we do have some bottom feeders, but there is consistently more parity in our league than any other of the top ten leagues. We have had years where all 10 teams were right around top-100 or better, whereas your ACCs and Big10s always have a couple true bottom feeders with sub-150 or sub-200 teams.

Fine, Villanova is the only team to make the Final 4 during the first 8 years of the new Big East. BUT (and that is a huge BUT), they won the tournament both times. And, unlike the Gonzagas of the world, they DID NOT go undefeated in league play either of those years. Which means that Big East teams were able to compete with the best team in the country those years.

As for us only coming close to the promised land twice, and then blowing our one and only shot, I call BS. How many number one seeds does it take to win a NC? Or even make the Final 4? There have been some truly great teams that have not gone all the way despite drawing a 1 or 2 seed.

Sort this list for total NCAA tournament appearances and total final 4s: https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/

You will quickly see that there is a very strong correlation between number of attempts and Final 4s and NCs.

Here is a list of some of the best teams to not win the tournament: https://www.sportingnews.com/us/ncaa-ba ... rs8agqv/37

Finally... we have come close to a Final 4 more than once. Sure, we got handily beat during 2 of 3 Elite 8 appearances. But during the year of the run, two quick touch fouls cost us the game. We also had the favorite team and national runner up, OSU, beat in the second round until Greg Oden did not get called for a clearly flagrant foul and we then missed the two FTs. There is a very good chance that team would have at least made it to the Elite 8 or beyond after that win. We also had a few S16 teams that were just edged out.

What it all boils down to is that our trajectory was toward our first Final four in the next 3-5 years. But then Chris Mack left and the program lost all momentum. Some people hated Mack and wanted to see him go. Those same people now want to see his obvious replacement to hit the road too... Who knows how long it will take now.
Let's March!
tacitus
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Re: "Rivals" ranks recruiting classes for 2021 and 2022, so far. and Xavier ranks....

Postby tacitus » Mon Apr 26, 2021 5:45 pm

Now with the addition of UCONN, who is hungry to revive past glory, the Big East is poised to be the one of the best leagues for the foreseeable future, and probably one of the most competitive top-to-bottom. I just hope we can continue to compete over the next few years. I have no doubt that the Big East will be sending a handful of teams to the Final 4 and beyond over the next decade. I want one of those teams to be us!
Let's March!
Anti-Homer
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Re: "Rivals" ranks recruiting classes for 2021 and 2022, so far. and Xavier ranks....

Postby Anti-Homer » Mon Apr 26, 2021 7:38 pm

tacitus wrote:
Mon Apr 26, 2021 5:45 pm
Now with the addition of UCONN, who is hungry to revive past glory, the Big East is poised to be the one of the best leagues for the foreseeable future, and probably one of the most competitive top-to-bottom. I just hope we can continue to compete over the next few years. I have no doubt that the Big East will be sending a handful of teams to the Final 4 and beyond over the next decade. I want one of those teams to be us!
Back to back very solid posts. Sadly, this is something that Mman hasn't expressed to me re: any of mine in over a year. Thankfully, Edgecliff has picked up the slack.

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